Comments on: Blog Comparison #1 - La Pesadilla Before Christmas http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/ Learn Spanish with Free Podcasts Whether you are student or a seasoned speaker, our lessons offer something for everyone. We incorporate culture and current issues into each episode to give the most informative, both linguistically and culturally, podcasts possible. For those of you with just the plane ride to prepare, check our survival phrase series at SpanishPod101.com. One of these phrases just might turn your trip into the best one ever! Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:58:24 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.11 by: David http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-190 Tue, 08 Jan 2008 00:13:44 +0000 http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-190 Aurelio: (First of all, I'll write in English so others can understand this entry) Undoubtly you have a deep knowledge of Spanish, cause this is a very complex point. This topic gives me cause for introducing an interesting issue about Spanish: "impersonal sentences". Impersonal sentences are sentences which lack subject. In Spanish one can omit subject in phrases where the subject can be implied: Te lo dijo = (Él) te lo dijo = He told you But this is not the sort of impersonal sentences that interests us; I'll introduce the sintactically impersonal sentences, which are those that have no subject (and the subject cannot be infered). Sentences like: Está lloviendo = It's rainning Aquí se vive bien = You live well here But there is a special case of impersonal sentences: "pasivas reflejas" (reflexive passive). They are passive sentences with the shape of a reflexive sentence (pronoun "se" + verb): Active: (El cura) Celebra una boda = The priest performs a wedding Passive: Es celebrada una boda = A wedding is performed Reflexive passive: Se celebra una boda = A wedding is performed So, although it looks like a reflexive, it's really a passive sentence. In this case, the passive verb agrees with the passive subject: Reflexive passive: Se celebra una boda = A wedding is performed Passive: Es celebrada una boda Reflexive passive: Se celebran varias bodas = Several weddings are performed Passiva: Son celebradas varias bodas Despite all this, you are right about your comment "se celebran a los muertos chiquitos" is not correct cause "a los muertos chiquitos" is not the passive subject (subjects are not preceded by prepositions). Let's try to find the way to this mistake: Active: (Los mejicanos) Celebran a los muertos chiquitos = Mexicans celebrate little deads My opinion is that the mistake is here: "celebrar" doesn't take the preposition "a". Passive: Son celebrados a [mistake] los muertos chiquitos = "Little deads" are celebrated Reflexive passive: Se celebran a [mistake] los muertos chiquitos = "Little deads" are celebrated But, if the original active sentence was: Active: (Los mejicanos) Celebran los muertos chiquitos = Mexicans celebrate "little deads" Then the passive ones would be correct: Passive: Son celebrados los muertos chiquitos = "Little deads" are celebrated Reflexive passive: Se celebran los muertos chiquitos = "Little deads" are celebrated Hope this helps you all. If you find any mistake in this comment, please, let me know. Regards, David. Aurelio:

(First of all, I’ll write in English so others can understand this entry)

Undoubtly you have a deep knowledge of Spanish, cause this is a very complex point. This topic gives me cause for introducing an interesting issue about Spanish: “impersonal sentences”.

Impersonal sentences are sentences which lack subject. In Spanish one can omit subject in phrases where the subject can be implied:

Te lo dijo = (Él) te lo dijo = He told you

But this is not the sort of impersonal sentences that interests us; I’ll introduce the sintactically impersonal sentences, which are those that have no subject (and the subject cannot be infered). Sentences like:

Está lloviendo = It’s rainning
Aquí se vive bien = You live well here

But there is a special case of impersonal sentences: “pasivas reflejas” (reflexive passive). They are passive sentences with the shape of a reflexive sentence (pronoun “se” + verb):

Active: (El cura) Celebra una boda = The priest performs a wedding
Passive: Es celebrada una boda = A wedding is performed
Reflexive passive: Se celebra una boda = A wedding is performed

So, although it looks like a reflexive, it’s really a passive sentence. In this case, the passive verb agrees with the passive subject:

Reflexive passive: Se celebra una boda = A wedding is performed
Passive: Es celebrada una boda

Reflexive passive: Se celebran varias bodas = Several weddings are performed
Passiva: Son celebradas varias bodas

Despite all this, you are right about your comment “se celebran a los muertos chiquitos” is not correct cause “a los muertos chiquitos” is not the passive subject (subjects are not preceded by prepositions). Let’s try to find the way to this mistake:

Active: (Los mejicanos) Celebran a los muertos chiquitos = Mexicans celebrate little deads

My opinion is that the mistake is here: “celebrar” doesn’t take the preposition “a”.

Passive: Son celebrados a [mistake] los muertos chiquitos = “Little deads” are celebrated
Reflexive passive: Se celebran a [mistake] los muertos chiquitos = “Little deads” are celebrated

But, if the original active sentence was:

Active: (Los mejicanos) Celebran los muertos chiquitos = Mexicans celebrate “little deads”

Then the passive ones would be correct:

Passive: Son celebrados los muertos chiquitos = “Little deads” are celebrated
Reflexive passive: Se celebran los muertos chiquitos = “Little deads” are celebrated

Hope this helps you all. If you find any mistake in this comment, please, let me know.

Regards,
David.

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by: SpanishPod101.com http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-75 Sun, 23 Dec 2007 23:40:46 +0000 http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-75 FE DE ERRATA Aurelio Asiain, Gracias por habernos avisado de los dos errores. Agradecemos la atención. Hemos corregido el error del título. También corregimos el error de concorancia en las transcipciones. Dentro de poco corregiremos el audioblog correspondiente al texto. In light of this mistake, for our English speakers, the correct construction, as Aurelio rightly points out, is "se celebra a los muertos chiquitos", which means "the little deceased ones are celebrated", in the passive voice. The scripts have been corrected and the revised audio is soon to follow. Thanks again for the heads-up. Saludos, Joseph FE DE ERRATA

Aurelio Asiain,

Gracias por habernos avisado de los dos errores. Agradecemos la atención. Hemos corregido el error del título. También corregimos el error de concorancia en las transcipciones. Dentro de poco corregiremos el audioblog correspondiente al texto.

In light of this mistake, for our English speakers, the correct construction, as Aurelio rightly points out, is “se celebra a los muertos chiquitos”, which means “the little deceased ones are celebrated”, in the passive voice.

The scripts have been corrected and the revised audio is soon to follow.

Thanks again for the heads-up.

Saludos,

Joseph

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by: Aurelio Asiain http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-74 Sun, 23 Dec 2007 20:31:42 +0000 http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-74 Lamento decirlo, pero he descubierto dos errores en el blog. El primero, en la presentación escrita de esta página: donde dice “Dead of the Dead” debe decir “Day of the Dead”. El otro es más grave, y está en el podcast de esta lección, en el audioblog de Gayne, cuando ella dice "se celebran a los muertos chiquitos". Debería decir "se celebra a los muertos chiquitos". La concordancia no es con "los muertos", sino con el sujeto impersonal de la frase. Joseph lo dice bien la primera vez que comenta la frase, pero después Beatriz y el propio Joseph repiten el error de Gayne. Saludos, Aurelio Asiain Lamento decirlo, pero he descubierto dos errores en el blog. El primero, en la presentación escrita de esta página: donde dice “Dead of the Dead” debe decir “Day of the Dead”. El otro es más grave, y está en el podcast de esta lección, en el audioblog de Gayne, cuando ella dice “se celebran a los muertos chiquitos”. Debería decir “se celebra a los muertos chiquitos”. La concordancia no es con “los muertos”, sino con el sujeto impersonal de la frase. Joseph lo dice bien la primera vez que comenta la frase, pero después Beatriz y el propio Joseph repiten el error de Gayne.

Saludos,

Aurelio Asiain

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by: SpanishPod101.com http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-15 Mon, 17 Dec 2007 16:02:25 +0000 http://www.spanishpod101.com/2007/12/22/blog-comparison-1-la-pesadilla-before-christmas/#comment-15 ¡Hola todos! Son grandes las diferencias entre estas celebraciones, ¿no? (The differences between these celebrations are big, right?) Is anyone familiar with "la música criolla del Perú"? Which is your favorite song/composer? A mí me encanta Arturo "Zambo" Caverro. I love Arutro "Zambo" Caverro! Especially his song, Rebecca... ¡Hola todos! Son grandes las diferencias entre estas celebraciones, ¿no? (The differences between these celebrations are big, right?)

Is anyone familiar with “la música criolla del Perú”? Which is your favorite song/composer?

A mí me encanta Arturo “Zambo” Caverro. I love Arutro “Zambo” Caverro! Especially his song, Rebecca…

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